So, the more clever among you figured out the solution to yesterday’s post: all five posts are, indeed, from Sonic 3. So what’s the point, you say?
There has been a lot of handwringing among the community over the past few months about “the state of the fanbase”; how we’re all horrible people who have turned against each other and now are super! mean! bad! people! In fact, this is all because of Sonic 4 or Sonic Free Riders or because there was an abandonment of ~black eyes~! However, my point is this: there always was and always will be people who are angry or upset or dislike things amongst any group of people. They were around in 1990, 2000 and 2010. There are people who are going to try to take advantage of those things in order to make people even more upset. Some people relish in making others feel that the thing they enjoy as a hobby is lame; therefore, they expend all their energies on making people think they’re wasting their time.
That, of course, is a load of crap. Things have always been the way they are, but the only thing that matters is whether you’re enjoying yourself or not. The reason we at Retro stay around is because so much of making fun of things is not being afraid to make fun of yourself. Because we’re in a fandom that could spawn Shadow the Hedgehog 2 with Big and Froggy.
So, I’m proposing a contest: learn more about the fandom you’re a part of by reading some of its oldest posts, get a laugh and learn that it isn’t as bad as people freak out over. Some of the USENET quotes I posted were pretty great in “the more things change, the more they stay the same” sense, but there’s a ton of ironic posts, things which make no sense in a modern context, things which are creepy predictions of the future that came true. Submit your best pre-1997 Internet commentary concerning Sonic; we’ll take a look and our favorites will receive ~fabulous prizes~. Then again, it’ll be hard to follow up this gem in a 1990 post on rec.games.video:
>Sonic, the Hedgehog, Action, SEGA
>[SEGA’s answer to Mario and Bonk]
Actually I think SEGA already has SEVERAL answers to Mario and Bonk…
and their names are Shinobi, Wonder Boy, Alex Kidd, and Space Harrier…
To find old posts, check out Google Groups or fire up your favorite newsgroup client. Other forms of early communication, such as the rat.org mailing list, are also fair game if you can track them down. The contest ends March 1, 2011, so be sure to have your entries submitted through the comments section by then.
Nice. I’d really love to take your challenge! Buuuu~t seeing as how I’m a lazy bastard who nevertheless wants to pass all my classes this semester, chances are I won’t. Not stopping me from going on the wayback machine, but it’s nice to have that added incentive.
Yeah, MD, if you get an off-chance, just post something. I’ve got plenty of SEGA swag to hand off. You’ve got a good chance at winnin’.
Alright, lets give this a go:
“Sonic is one of those Christopher Columbus games; once you’ve explored all the levels and seen all the scenery, it just ain’t fun any more.”
Oh I totally agree. It’s just what happens when you take individuals’ opinions as a group’s opinion. It’s why every fanbase can appear stupid. Whether they like a certain genre of music, video game, film, art, whatever.
I’m still searching for a good one, but till then I found this gem.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.fan.sonic-hedgehog/browse_thread/thread/57bd2eaf84fd120c# – lol Ken Penders
I can openly admit I fucking LOVED Sonic and the Secret Rings. It’s good to know people actually realize it’s about what YOU like, not what the fans like and just trying to keep up with them.
Excellent post, as usual, Scarred Sun.
Seriously, if you can stand in a mirror and 100% get behind loving a current generation Sonic game, I envy you. I have wanted to do that since back when I was 8 and the year was 1995, but I still haven’t been able to since that time. I play Sonic 1, 2, 3&K, Megamix, 2 Long Version, and Retro Remix just to name a few, just waiting for a proper video game, just like the old times. Maybe one day Sega will grant my wish, and put out a game I like, but until then I’ll stick to the hacks that come out and work on one of my own… Seriously, Congratulations to you!
Yeah it’s strange I used to be in this weird phase where if sonic fans didntnlike it; I didn’t like it. In all honesty though, I do believe a lot of these games are flawed to am extreme, but I still get enjoyment out of playing and beating them, so yeah.
I agree though; Megamix was fucking insane. The fact I could play that masterpiece on the go (psp emulator) made it even better.
I found these in a discussion of Sonic 2.
“The other biggies I’d like to see are: greater randomness the problem with Mario and Sonic and many other games is the lack of randomness that limits the replayability of the game.”
“My personal opinion is that Sega shouldn’t waste its time with Sonic 2. The Sonic/Mario/Bonk sorta things aren’t really games, just a bunch of completely unrelated stuff all mashed together into a single cartridge. The only common thread throughout the game is the fact that there is a hedgehog (or caveman or plumber) onscreen.”
Wow. This one is amazing. It make absolutely no sense.
I didn’t know people still remembered Bonk.
These posts were from the early 90s, so Bonk was relevant at the time.
Alright I can always count on retro to bring us news on another fantastic addition to the sonic franchise. So when does shadow 2 with big and froggy come out?
Shadow 2 with Big and Froggy… Lol, that’s Xbox for ya, even though the game doesn’t really exist.
“Stefan Rimaila wrote: Just to make clear of Sonic “3D” and the “old” 2D. You can never ever make a 3D character to look as good as the “original” 2D character (or something to that direction..). Anyway, 2D is _always_ better that 3D (think of Sonic with the Quake engine..), if the game have been published as 2D, it should stay as 2D and not “get the hype” or “the evolution”. The evolution says that a precise year all the computer games should move to 3D (a rule??), anyway think even of Sonic 3D (like Quake) or then with a external view (ewww…). Get the hype thing is like people in Finland; MY neighbor brought a car, I brought two. If someone makes a “cool” 3D game, everyone else makes the same; tries to make a “copy” of it instead of sitting back in the old (not _always_ necessary). The “old” can also be good. The word “old” does NEVER EVER mean that “Teehee, that game’s a platform type. It’s shit and no-one wants it..”, but in the fact it’s not really like that. People will always sometime love a platform-jumper so they’re going to exist (almost) forever as long as people want them. My opinion of Sonic 3D (or if it were Sonic Jam.. not sure) that f**k the 3D engine. People could love that game but they will never win the first and original Sonic 1 Platform (Genesis / Master System).”
This guy’s English sucked, but he saw the writing on the wall. =p
Oh yeah, the quote is from circa 97 (the original comment quoted is gone).
And from now on I will remember that these comments don’t have a damn edit button.
So it’s 1998, and one of the first disillusioned fans comes out of the woodwork, lamenting Sonic’s seeming decline. In response, this funny tidbit was posted:
“I have a feeling that once this Dreamcast is out, that Sega and Sonic
will regain the popularity it once had. Also, I think the N64’s arrival
has really ruined people’s image of Sonic, too. After that happened,
people gave up on Sonic fandom, and became born-again Mario/Nintendo fans.
Don’t worry, people! Hang in there until the Dreamcast comes out, then
Sonic will regain it’s popularity. Besides, if Sonic wasn’t popular
anymore, they wouldn’t be making Sonic Underground, would they? Think
about it. So, please just once let’s be positive, after all, we’re Sonic
fans, and we priase Sonic, right?”
And, from the same discussion:
“I know 3 things that might boost his popularity (sp)
1. STH Giga pets
2. STH RPG
3. STH Gathering (Magic the gathering)
Brandon the Hedgehog ”
Then, someone whines that people don’t like them because they like Sonic, and that their mom thinks it’s weird when they write fanfics. So, someone replied:
“Anyone who laughs at you for liking sonic is an idiot.
Liking Sonci makes a whole lot more sense than Sports.
“Screw saving the planet, this oddly shaped ball MUST go through those
….Yeah, that whole topic is just gold.
Found a couple more. Here’s a couple from 1995:
“SandK did bomb. Due to lack of originality. It was just like Sonic 3.”
“The first Sonic game looked cool but the rest looked lame. All the Sonic games look identical “In terms of graphics”
“I dusted Chaotix the first time I played it. The whole game is essentially pointless. ”
Here’s someone’s first impressions of Sonic 2 from 1992:
“Well, I managed to get a copy of Sonic 2 tonight.
It is a pretty nice sequel, although, I personally feel
that its almost the same thing all over again.
I mean, the graphics are nostalgially identical,
except new scenery, (the waterfalls, and ivy on the walls
look really nice though)… And what’s the point of having
Tails run after you? I just started playing it so these
are just initial reactions… but I really couldn’t find a use
for him… I don’t have a second Sega paddle so I oucldn’t get (oops, couldn’t) the 2 player co-op mode to work… I’d like
to try that out as well as the split screen… the split screen graphics are REALLY weird… they’re vertically squashed.. but it’s pretty fast… the graphics are much more clear than the first one. I have yet to reach the stage (bonus) with the tunnel sequence… Don’t get me wrong, I like the game, I just don’t think this is the next best game since the release of SF2 for the SNES.”
From 1997, during a debate about S3&K vs. SCD:
“Sonic3 and S&K are too easy. Sega was lacking when they made that
game. It shoulda been halted till the Saturn came out, then stuck onna
CD with 50 or so ACTUAL tunes. This game is so easy, a five year old
could play it, beat it, and program a better one. I think the Sonic CD
game is by far better than Sonic1-2-3-Knuckles 3D Blast, Spinball, and
whatever else. Sonic CD was the first Sonic game to come out on a CD in
America, and the first game Sega ever made that had lyrics in the songs.
A new wave for Sega. It lacks control, but it does have good clean
graphics and tight sound. Just my opinion tho.
PS: I still got Sonic CD for Sega CD and Sonic CD-Rom. I have a
psychotic thought that some day the Sega CD version will be worth money
cuz of the typo in the booklet. That typo about Amy Rose being Princess
From the same discussion, someone comments on Sonic CD’s American soundtrack. His complaints are worded quite similarly to complaints on Sonic 4’s music:
“Ugh. I listened to the music from SCD (I haven’t played the game, but I’ve
heard the music off Sonic & Knuckles Collection) and first I played the
music from Palmtree Panic. Then it immediately became boring. It was just
TECHNO after TECHNO after TECHNO after TECHNO… a lot of the tracks would be perfect for Metallic Madness Zone because that’s what the music is:
metallic madness. I don’t hate techno (in fact, I like techno) but Sonic CD’s techno was SO REPETITIVE! SONG after SONG had the same insturments and
feeling. It got annoying fast!”
And this one’s a little late, (from 2002), but it’s still funny.
“some rumors have started that shadow didn’t die, but that he faked his death. why would he do that?
i think its because he owed sonic money.”
In 2002, someone made a topic in a newsgroup titled “How about an official Sonic 4?” The poster wrote:
“It’s about time that Sega went back to basics and used the formula
that made Sonic famous in the first place. I’m sure I’m not the only
one that agrees that a pure Sonic action game should be considered.
Not everyone enjoys digging for emeralds or having to search for your
next destination. To make Sonic appeal to a more mass market, the next
game in the series should be heavily action-based. Sonic Team should
take a chance and just develop one game without Knuckles, Tails, or
Amy as core playable characters . Sonic is what made the series a
success and although Sonic Adventure is a fine game, I’ve felt more
magic when I played the 16-bit Sonic games (with the exception of
Sonic 3D Blast). The 3D graphics should stay intact but the free
roaming gameplay needs to go. Here’s to hoping that Sonic Team has the
same thing in mind as I do. ”
One of the replies to that post:
“If I want to play the old Sonic games, that’s what I kept them for. I
don’t see how releasing a total rehash of the old gameplay would be a good
I hack soinc 2 and the level select went starge it had
Emerld hill 1 Sky Chase 12 2Labyrinth 1 Oil Ocean 12 2Wood 1 Mystic Cave 12 2Dust Hill 1 Casino Night12 2Metropoilsh1 Chemical Plant 12 2Metropilsh 3 Genociad city 14 2Sky Fortross 1 Neo Green Hill 12 2Hidden Place 1 Death Egg 12 2